Psychedelia.dk

Velkommen til psychedelia.dk. Vi er Danmarks største community for fornuftig anvendelse af rusmidler og legalisering.
Dato og tid er 17 jun 2019 15:20


Alle tider er UTC + 1 time [DST ]




Skriv nyt emne Svar på emne  [ 297 indlæg ]  Gå til side Foregående  1 ... 11, 12, 13, 14, 15
Forfatter besked
Indlæg: 06 sep 2017 20:24 
Offline
Psychedelia Sponsor
Brugeravatar

Tilmeldt: 07 okt 2008 09:49
Indlæg: 1306
Geografisk sted: Wonderland
I den sidste ende er det lige meget.
Mængden af psilocybin forbliver den samme, svampen bliver bare større.

_________________
Jo mere man ved; jo mere ved man, man ikke ved..

йети skrev:
Umiddelbart vil jeg tro at det generelt ikke er særligt udbredt at brænde sin kokain af. Hvorfor gør du det?


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 06 sep 2017 21:28 
Offline
Dedikeret medlem
Brugeravatar

Tilmeldt: 24 aug 2012 19:07
Indlæg: 730
Pestilence skrev:
I den sidste ende er det lige meget.
Mængden af psilocybin forbliver den samme, svampen bliver bare større.


Kan det være rigtigt, er det så meningen man skal spise Asuresens på styk dosis, og ikke vægt dosis.


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 07 sep 2017 13:49 
Offline
Psychedelia Sponsor
Brugeravatar

Tilmeldt: 07 okt 2008 09:49
Indlæg: 1306
Geografisk sted: Wonderland
Jeg vil altid gå efter vægten.
Der kan være en del forskel på svamp A og svamp B, både på størrelse og alkaloidindhold.

_________________
Jo mere man ved; jo mere ved man, man ikke ved..

йети skrev:
Umiddelbart vil jeg tro at det generelt ikke er særligt udbredt at brænde sin kokain af. Hvorfor gør du det?


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 07 sep 2017 16:34 
Offline
Junior medlem

Tilmeldt: 02 okt 2016 14:06
Indlæg: 13
Der kommer vel en større mængde aktive stoffer jo større svampen bliver?
Det du mener er nok, at små svampe er ligeså aktive som store, hvis de sammenlignes gram for gram.

Imponerende at der allerede er svampe hos nogle, mon det et de rigtige ; )


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 07 sep 2017 17:55 
Offline
Psychedelia Sponsor
Brugeravatar

Tilmeldt: 07 okt 2008 09:49
Indlæg: 1306
Geografisk sted: Wonderland
Ja, til et punkt. Efter det punkt går det nedad, da der ikke bliver produceret mere psilocybin og psilocin, men samtidigt vokser svampen sig større. Så de aktive stoffer bliver rent procentmæssigt lavere. Men de forsvinder ikke.
Men altså, når alt er sagt og gjort, så betyder det ikke noget i det store hele. :)

_________________
Jo mere man ved; jo mere ved man, man ikke ved..

йети skrev:
Umiddelbart vil jeg tro at det generelt ikke er særligt udbredt at brænde sin kokain af. Hvorfor gør du det?


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 07 sep 2017 19:38 
Offline
Junior medlem

Tilmeldt: 02 okt 2016 14:06
Indlæg: 13
Det punkt, formoder jeg, er når svampen har smidt sine sporer og visner?


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 07 sep 2017 19:49 
Offline
Moderator
Brugeravatar

Tilmeldt: 03 apr 2002 01:01
Indlæg: 2380
Geografisk sted: Sjælland
Psychofreak, er du sluppet af med muggen?

_________________
All perverts may not be marijuana smokers, but practically all marijuana smokers are perverts.
Colonel Garland Williams, former head of U.S. Narcotics Enforcement


Idag kan vi dø af at elske med hinanden
Så vi lever som vi gør. fordi vi ved vi' på spanden
Verden er for fuld af lort, til jeg kan sortere
Så jeg prøver bare på at få mit liv til at fungere


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 07 sep 2017 20:09 
Offline
Psychedelia Sponsor
Brugeravatar

Tilmeldt: 07 okt 2008 09:49
Indlæg: 1306
Geografisk sted: Wonderland
manos skrev:
Det punkt, formoder jeg, er når svampen har smidt sine sporer og visner?


Ja. Det bedste tidspunkt at høste er lige inden sløret giver slip.
Men når vi snakker azurescens i udendørs bed, så kan jeg godt se en fordel i at lade nogle af svampene smide deres sporer.

_________________
Jo mere man ved; jo mere ved man, man ikke ved..

йети skrev:
Umiddelbart vil jeg tro at det generelt ikke er særligt udbredt at brænde sin kokain af. Hvorfor gør du det?


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 07 sep 2017 20:34 
Offline
Dedikeret medlem
Brugeravatar

Tilmeldt: 24 aug 2012 19:07
Indlæg: 730
Pestilence skrev:
Ja, til et punkt. Efter det punkt går det nedad, da der ikke bliver produceret mere psilocybin og psilocin, men samtidigt vokser svampen sig større. Så de aktive stoffer bliver rent procentmæssigt lavere. Men de forsvinder ikke.
Men altså, når alt er sagt og gjort, så betyder det ikke noget i det store hele. :)


Jeg har for 16-17 år siden set en Cubensis i den nedlagte butik soma- den var sømmet op på væggen bag disken. Den var enorm stor og deform og målte nok 30 gange 30 cm. Et estimat var vel 50 gram i tør vægt. Hvis en lille svamp skulle være ligeså psykoaktiv som en stor svamp, ville den jo være enormt svag. Jeg ville ihvertfald ikke kaste mig i lag med 50 gram selvom det kun var en svamp.


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 07 sep 2017 20:40 
Det lyder mystisk. Nu har jeg sådanset kun erfaring med SN, men der ved jeg i hvert fald, at der er kæmpe forskel på, at spise 100stk fuldvoksne og 100 små.


Top
  
 
Indlæg: 07 sep 2017 20:55 
Offline
Dedikeret medlem
Brugeravatar

Tilmeldt: 24 aug 2012 19:07
Indlæg: 730
Bubber skrev:
Psychofreak, er du sluppet af med muggen?


Det endte op med at efter en 14 dages tid efter i var hos mig, at jeg åbnede urtepotterne igen.
Det var en gentagelse fra sidste gang- enormt meget grøn mug yderst, og mindre grønt inderst.

Jeg smed der grønne ned ved valnøddetræet som sidst, og det hvid/grønne blandede jeg sammen med de kontaminerede rugkerner, hvor jeg dog først tog det øverste grønne væk, som jeg også smed ned ved valnøddetræet.
Resten der så var mest hvidt gravede jeg et hul til bag huset på nordsiden, og blandede lidt mere frisk træ, ( gjorde det vist også ved valnøddetræet) og sendte en bøn til Psylocobinos.
Faktisk ser det ud til at langt det meste grønne mug i begge bede er væk.
Kan kun se tiden an :gud:


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 07 sep 2017 22:00 
Offline
Psychedelia Sponsor
Brugeravatar

Tilmeldt: 07 okt 2008 09:49
Indlæg: 1306
Geografisk sted: Wonderland
Psykofreak skrev:
Pestilence skrev:
Ja, til et punkt. Efter det punkt går det nedad, da der ikke bliver produceret mere psilocybin og psilocin, men samtidigt vokser svampen sig større. Så de aktive stoffer bliver rent procentmæssigt lavere. Men de forsvinder ikke.
Men altså, når alt er sagt og gjort, så betyder det ikke noget i det store hele. :)


Jeg har for 16-17 år siden set en Cubensis i den nedlagte butik soma- den var sømmet op på væggen bag disken. Den var enorm stor og deform og målte nok 30 gange 30 cm. Et estimat var vel 50 gram i tør vægt. Hvis en lille svamp skulle være ligeså psykoaktiv som en stor svamp, ville den jo være enormt svag. Jeg ville ihvertfald ikke kaste mig i lag med 50 gram selvom det kun var en svamp.


Det lyder til at håbe være en ordentlig basse. Det ville have været en halv kilo svamp som frisk. :D

De er lige aktive. Hvis der er 0.63% psilocybin i svampene, så er det jo ligemeget om det er en 0.5 gram svamp eller 50 gram svamp. 1 gram ville stadig indeholde samme mængde psilocybin. Det er derfor jeg siger at jeg ville gå efter vægt og ikke antal.


Hvis vi siger du har en frisk svamp på 5 gram til at gro, og den svamp har 1% psilocybin i sig, så er det 50mg psilocybin. Den skal lige til at smide sporer, så den laver ikke mere psilocybin.
Svampen vokser videre og vejer nu 6 gram. Den producerer ikke mere psilocybin, så der er stadig 50mg. Så er der kun 0.83% psilocybin i svampen.

Men det er jo ligemeget for personen der skal indtage svampen, for i tør tilstand er det 0.1 gram forskel. :)

_________________
Jo mere man ved; jo mere ved man, man ikke ved..

йети skrev:
Umiddelbart vil jeg tro at det generelt ikke er særligt udbredt at brænde sin kokain af. Hvorfor gør du det?


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 12 sep 2017 15:46 
Offline
Junior medlem

Tilmeldt: 02 okt 2016 14:06
Indlæg: 13
Psykofreak skrev:
Mit mycelie udendørs er ikke pindet endnu. Men en af mine venner der fik et glas rugkerner, og plantede det i en altankasse, han har haft på en hylde under sine chillier har pindet nu.
Mit spørgsmål er ganske simpelt- er det ligesom med Cubensis at de skal høstes før de smider sporene,
eller er det ligegyldigt.

Smid et billede op af de tidlige svampe, ellers er det ikke sket :wink:


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 12 sep 2017 16:14 
Offline
Dedikeret medlem
Brugeravatar

Tilmeldt: 24 aug 2012 19:07
Indlæg: 730
manos skrev:
Psykofreak skrev:
Mit mycelie udendørs er ikke pindet endnu. Men en af mine venner der fik et glas rugkerner, og plantede det i en altankasse, han har haft på en hylde under sine chillier har pindet nu.
Mit spørgsmål er ganske simpelt- er det ligesom med Cubensis at de skal høstes før de smider sporene,
eller er det ligegyldigt.

Smid et billede op af de tidlige svampe, ellers er det ikke sket :wink:


Ka jeg så ikke.
Fik dem tilsendt på Wirck og de er borte med blæsten nu.


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 16 sep 2017 08:17 
Offline
Junior medlem

Tilmeldt: 02 okt 2016 14:06
Indlæg: 13
Så er de første cyans her:-)
Yay :shock:


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 04 dec 2017 10:06 
Offline
Moderator
Brugeravatar

Tilmeldt: 04 dec 2004 14:22
Indlæg: 2404
Geografisk sted: Friland
Tog du nogle billeder, vi må se?


Billede
Billede
troede jeg havde mistet disse billeder fra mit gamle skovprojekt


Top
 Profil  
 
Indlæg: 04 mar 2019 06:26 
Offline
Moderator
Brugeravatar

Tilmeldt: 04 dec 2004 14:22
Indlæg: 2404
Geografisk sted: Friland
leaf skrev:
Er der nogen herinde der har oplevet en form for lammelse (paralyse) eller lignende bivirkninger af Ps. Azurescens som omtales i disse tråde?

http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showfla ... r/14012628
https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default. ... ts&t=38626


https://psychedelicreview.com/wood-love ... d-mystery/
Citat:
The term “wood lover paralysis” refers to a temporary state of muscle weakness and/or paralysis that begins several hours after consuming certain types of “magic mushrooms.” The phenomenon appears to occur only after ingesting magic mushroom species that grow on wood, hence the name wood lover paralysis.

Wood lover paralysis is reported most often for the species Psilocybe cyanescens and Psilocybe azurescens. It has also been reported for the following: P. allenii, P. stunzii, P. subaeruginosa, P. pelliculosa, and P. ovoideocystidiata.

Despite many anecdotal reports of wood lover paralysis (see below), no controlled scientific studies have been conducted. As a result, there is no consensus as to either the cause or solution to this longstanding problem.

Below are some illustrative anecdotal reports about the symptoms and attempted treatments for wood lover paralysis. Most of this information was found on blogs, such as Shroomery. We also discuss the leading theories for explaining the cause of wood lover paralysis.

One challenge in elucidating the wood lover paralysis problem is distinguishing its symptoms from similar sensations caused by taking highly unreliable amounts of powerful psychoactive drugs. For example, some psilocybin mushroom users appear to confuse the “body load” sensation with wood lover paralysis. Although both result in “heavy” feelings in the extremities, “body load” does not include extreme symptoms of paralysis such as loss of motor control and facial drooping.
Symptoms of Wood Lover Paralysis

Below are some first-hand reports, taken from popular “magic mushroom” discussion forums. We have highlighted language showing the symptoms that appear to be consistent across all accounts. They are:

Loss of motor control, ranging from incoordination to complete paralysis
Loss of motor function in face/eyes
Delayed onset of about 4-6 hours
Resolution of symptoms within 24 hours

“the “paralysis” manifested as waves of losing most of the motor control of my limbs. If I was standing one minute, I was crumpled on the floor flailing about the next.”
About 4 hours into a trip, “I got half way to the kitchen and suddenly my legs felt like they were going to collapse. I sat down for 5 minutes, got up again, walked for a bit- and then my legs DID collapse. It was a little scary because I felt clear headed, there was no pain or numbness… just non-functional legs.”
“I collapsed in the middle of a field. I couldn’t walk 5 blocks. My co-tripper couldn’t smile the next day. I have experienced many muscular problems on these two species [psilocybe cyanescens and psilocybe azurescens]. They effect these muscle parts/groups: eye, facial, esophageal, hand and leg…. I have never had similar effects on [cubensis].”
“First noticeable symptoms are blurred vision, hand cramping/numbness, then loss of facial/mouth movement followed by having a hard time walking then full loss of the ability to walk properly or even stand period.” Link.
“during the comedown, well passed the peak, I experienced first a weird “jumping effect” in my vision where the center of focus in my vision would seem to spontaneously jump away from where I was commanding it to be, disorienting and blurring my vision. Then I experienced “clipping” of the energy in my legs – it was like the signal to walk or stand would flicker out, causing a lot of difficulty with walking (this effect went away when I would just sit down). And finally, there were weird twitchy contractions around the muscles that controlled the mouth that made regular speech difficult.”
“My friend … would try to stand up and his legs would collapse like jelly….he was also getting weird facial contractions where his mouth would distort similar to a mentally disabled person.”
Onset of “about 6 hours or so after eating them“
“One time walking to the bathroom was a massive struggle, I probably looked like I had cerebral palsy… and once I did make it to the bathroom, I couldn’t even raise my arms more than a few inches, and my legs were trembling, barely holding my weight. My vision was blurred, and when I looked in the mirror, I was literally slightly cross-eyed with one pupil still heavily dilated and the other in a normal state (lol).”
“The next day after a high dose trip I couldn’t hold a spoon properly, brush my teeth etc.“
“I was fine that night. The next morning I woke up and was having a hard time focusing my eyes and felt very uncoordinated….All of a sudden I completely lost control of both legs, and my hands got seized up weird and stuff. I was in the middle of the road in the campground paralyzed. My mind was clear but I couldn’t get up no matter how many times I tried….My hands were seized up and my face was numb and the muscles unresponsive for up to a couple of hours and it went away.”
“…my knees almost buckled under me. Major muscle weakness, I wouldn’t necessarily call it paralysis though.”
“Not full on paralysis, but I did realize how wobbly and weak my muscles were feeling under me.”
“I’ve experienced the [paralysis] situation after [consuming] fresh, dried and boiled (steeped) [mushrooms]. “
“I have had severe paralysis on ps cyanescens to the point I had to hit the floor because my muscles just gave out.”

Histamine Hypothesis and Proposed Anti-Histamine Treatments

Below are several quotes illustrating the hypothesis that some sort of histamine compound leads to the symptoms of wood lover paralysis.

Several people have proposed that Wood Lover Paralysis is related “a histamine reaction,” suggesting that “eating Benadryl will fix it.”
“Benadryl (diphenhydramine) is commonly used to treat certain types of acute movement disorders”
Histidine exists naturally in many types of fish. It is converted to histamine via the enzyme histidine decarboxylase produced by enteric bacteria like Clostridium botulinum. Histidine breaks down to histamine which is not destroyed by boiling water. Concentrated histamine is likely the main culprit. “I have successfully treated 5 people including myself of the dreaded paralysis with simple anti-histamines. This has worked 5 out of 5 times over the last 10 years. While there are probably more factors involved, I believe that histamine is the main cause of the Azurescens paralysis.”
Notably, the histamine hypothesis overlaps with the bacteria hypothesis. This is because some theories suggest bacterial contamination of the mushrooms creates histamine which causes the paralysis.
Some have drawn the distinction between (a) the molecule histamine itself and (b) molecules affecting one or more histamine receptors in the body.
“I don’t think the cause is due to ‘histamine’ in the wood-lovers. We don’t know the toxin responsible or exactly how it works, but it is likely it has some affinity for the histamine receptors, and/or interferes with dopamine-modulated movement.”
If the H1 blockers like Benadryl work as treatment, it is very likely that the H2 blockers cimetidine (Tagamet), ranitidine (Zantac), and famotidine ( Pepcid ) will work as well with less sedation. Benadryl and the other H2 blockers mentioned are available as over the counter medications. “As a potent antagonist to acetylcholine in muscarinic receptors, diphenhydramine is used to treat Parkinson’s disease-like extrapyramidal symptoms caused by antipsychotics. The muscarinic receptor antagonism leads to correction of levels of dopamine, the neurotransmitter responsible for control of motor function in the brain, similar to the effect of other antimuscarinic agents such as atropine.”

Side Effects of Unknown Chemical(s)

Some have suggested that the symptoms of wood lover paralysis could be caused by a chemical (other than psilocybin or psilocin) that is present in certain kinds of magic mushrooms. This makes good sense. The state of the art for psilocybin focuses almost exclusively on different mushrooms varieties instead of the molecules inside those mushrooms.

In terms of chemical understanding, the state of the art regards psilocin as the only active molecule with psilocybin serving as a prodrug for that active molecule. This macroscopic perspective overlooks many important chemical considerations, such as other active psilocybin derivatives and/or phenylethylamines. Further research into psilocybin chemistry — especially the chemical composition of each different species — would provide important insight as to the cause(s) of wood lover paralysis.
Bacterial Contamination Hypothesis

Some bacterial and/or microbial contaminations such as black rot are thought to be responsible for wood lovers paralysis.

“it is probably has something to do with bacteria(s) that create toxins. Botulism caused by the botulinum bacteria has been suggested to be the culprit, however, while botulism is possible, I am here provide a slightly different explanation to the issue at hand. “
“Botulism just doesn’t fit. If it was botulism people would be dying a lot more often and would most likely need antibiotics to help recover.”
“The build up of histamine caused by bacteria who are capable of producing histamine in spoiled food, particularly fish, clams, mushrooms etc. I have heard that the more damaged your shrooms the more likely they are harboring bacteria that are responsible for producing the high levels of histamine.”
” I have been leaning towards the idea that the paralysis is due to the inhibition of the enzyme the breaks down acetylcholine. This causes an over-stimulation at a neuromuscular junction due to the excess of acetylcholine (ACh), as of a result of the inactivity of the AChE enzyme, which normally breaks down acetylcholine. The muscles stop responding to the bombardment of acetylcholine, leading to flaccid paralysis, respiratory failure, and other signs and symptoms reminiscent of organophosphate poisoning. Benadryl is a potent antimuscarinic (a competitive antagonist of muscarinic acetylcholine receptors). This could explain why taking it helps. It reduces the amount of ACh hitting the receptor and boom, you regain muscle movement and strength.”

Dose hypothesis

Perhaps the simplest hypothesis for wood lover paralysis is that the user ingested too many mushrooms. The famous mycologist Paul Stamets explains, “the difference between a medicine and a poison is often the dose.” This is a basic tenet in the study of toxicology, referred to as “the dose makes the poison.” Any substance has a harming potential if an organism is exposed to enough of it. For example, the median lethal dose (LD50) of water for mice is 25,000 mg/kg.

However, wood lover paralysis is not caused by simply administering too much psilocybin. First, the phenomenon appears to be caused by only certain species of wood-digesting psilocybin mushrooms. If the symptoms were caused by overdosing on psilocybin/psilocin, then those symptoms would also arise from people taking large doses of psilocybin mushrooms that do not grow on wood chips. For example, Psilocybe cubensis is probably the most popular psychoactive mushroom in the United States. It is very potent. And, it is almost certainly the most cultivated psychoactive mushroom. Nevertheless, people do not appear to get wood lover paralysis by ingesting large amounts of this species. This fact strongly suggests that psilocybin and psilocin are not causing the symptoms. Rather, wood loving mushrooms probably contain other molecule(s) that are not present in all “magic mushrooms.” See Chemical Hypothesis (above).


https://psychedelicreview.com/wood-love ... black-rot/
Citat:
The term “wood lover paralysis” refers to a temporary state of muscle weakness and/or paralysis that begins several hours after consuming certain types of “magic” mushrooms. The phenomenon appears to occur only after ingesting magic mushroom species that grow on wood,hence the name wood lover paralysis.

Despite many anecdotal reports of wood lover paralysis, no controlled scientific studies have been conducted. As a result, there is no consensus as to either the cause or solution to this longstanding problem.

In October of 2017, we summarized the available reports about the symptoms and attempted treatments for wood lover paralysis. Based on the information available, we concluded that these are the four leading theories:

Microbial (e.g., bacteria, fungus) contamination
Histamine
Dosage
Chemical Side Effect

Below, we discuss one type of “microbial” contamination that could account for the observed “wood lover paralysis” symptoms.

Note the severe black rotting on these psilocybe cyanesens. Further, note the milky white material developing in the black rot.
The Black Rot Hypothesis

Many varieties of wood loving mushrooms develop a black rot on their caps and stems. This rot is often described as “blue black” in color. The bluish color is probably caused by the rot damaging the mushroom resulting in the well known blue bruising phenomenon.

The photo below shows one example of advanced (or severe) black rot on a sample of Psilocybe cyanesens mushroom fruiting bodies. One particularly interesting observation captured in the phone is the presence of an opaque white liquid that seems to accompany the development of the black material. What is this black material? What is the white liquid that seems to accompany the developing black rot as it spreads?

Black rot is a reasonable potential cause of wood lover paralysis. The black rot is much more prevalent on wood-loving mushrooms like Psilocybe cyanesens and Psilocybe azurescens. These mushrooms are often harvested outdoors, where they are likely to encounter microbes. This would explain why there are relatively few (if any) reports of wood lover paralysis arising from indoor cultivated mushrooms such as Psilocybe cubensis. Arguably, controlled indoor conditions prevent contamination. Ultimately, preventing the contamination prevents the occurrence of wood lover paralysis.
Lingering Questions and Proposed Experiments:

For the same species of mushroom, could we control the presence of black rot? In other words, would it be possible to collect data from a group of subjects consuming one batch of mushrooms, varying only the presence or absence of the black rot?
Is there any information available about consuming black rot enriched samples? Does that correlate with a high incidence of wood lover paralysis?
Has anyone cultured and identified the black material that affects Psilocybe cyanesens or Psilocybe azurescens? If so, is that species known to produce any compounds (proteins or small molecules) that cause the symptoms observed for Wood Lover Paralysis?

_________________
Magien i hverdagen, er dig selv.


Top
 Profil  
 
Vis indlæg fra foregående:  Sorter efter  
Skriv nyt emne Svar på emne  [ 297 indlæg ]  Gå til side Foregående  1 ... 11, 12, 13, 14, 15

Alle tider er UTC + 1 time [DST ]


Hvem er online

Brugere der læser dette forum: Ingen og 2 gæster


Du kan ikke skrive nye emner
Du kan ikke besvare emner
Du kan ikke redigere dine indlæg
Du kan ikke slette dine indlæg

Søg efter:
Hop til:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
Danish translation & support by Olympus DK Team