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Romerriget?
https://psychedelia.dk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=85&t=12822
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Forfatter:  kratoumet [ 25 jan 2006 14:47 ]
Titel:  Romerriget?

Nu står jeg over for at skulle skrive den her berømte historieopgave for 2.g-elver, og eftersom emnet omkring brug af forskellige entheogener, er begyndt at interessere mig en del, kunne det jo være fee, hvis man kunne skrive noget om det. Det skal være indenfor Romerriget, og da jeg ikke rigtig har kunnet finde så meget på internettet, vil jeg tillade mig at spørge jer herinde til råds. Jeg håber at der er nogen, der vil kunne hjælpe mig i denne forbindelse! :)

hvis nogen kender til nogen bøger om emnet, vil også meget gerne høre om disse....

Forfatter:  Rex Mundi [ 25 jan 2006 14:58 ]
Titel: 

Jesus christ, det er altså ikke opgavecentralen.dk det her!

Men, jeg har da for 4 år siden skrevet en opgave om selvsamme emne du kan låne til inspiration.

http://shell2.eushells.com/~cecil/Rom.rtf

Forfatter:  Chiller [ 25 jan 2006 17:50 ]
Titel: 

Nogle mener der er en sammenhæng mellem soma (i den indiske tradition), ambrosia (i den græske/romerske tradition) og visse former for psykedelika. Det er jo kun en teori, men kunne nok være spændende at undersøge alligevel :wink:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soma :

"Hallucinogenic

There is no direct indication in the Rigveda [helligtekst i brahmanismen/hinduismen] that Soma is a mushroom. Nevertheless, the Vedas do not state that Soma was not a mushroom either, and several mushrooms have been suggested, most frequently (originally by R. Gordon Wasson in the 1960s) Amanita muscaria (Fly Agaric or Toadstool). The mushroom theory is supported by later Tibetan Buddhist legends connected with urine-drinking, and it is indeed possible that in Tibet, the shamanistic practice of eating psychedelic mushrooms, and subsequently drinking the urine of the one who has taken the mushroom, still containing much of the agent substance, has been connected with Vedic teminology surrounding Soma, but this would of course not imply that the plants used in Tibet were identical to the original Indo-Iranian Soma plant.

Terrence McKenna in his book "The Food Of Gods" debunks the Amarita Muscaria theory and suggests the psilocybin-containing Stropharia cubensis mushroom as a soma candidate. McKenna argues that effects of the Amarita Muscaria mushrooms contradict the description of Soma properties given in the Rigveda. Amarita Muscaria mushrooms hardly have any hallucinogenic properties, but rather produce inebriant effects. Psilocybin, the active psychoactive component in Stropharia Cubensis, on the other hand, has a strong hallucinogenic nature.

Cannabis was also suggested, also based on Tibetan evidence. The Tibetan word for Cannabis is So.Ma.Ra.Dza., apparently a borrowing from the Sanskrit soma-raja "king Soma" or possibly "soma rasa" / "soma juice" which could be the same as "bhang". The choice of Cannabis as a candidate is further supported by the traditional Zulu use of this drug for energizing warriors. Other candidates include Peganum harmala (Syrian Rue, suggested by David Flattery and Martin Schwartz in the 1980s), and species of Stropharia."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ambrosia :
"Many modern scholars, including Danny Staples, relate ambrosia to the hallucinogenic mushroom Amanita muscaria."

Forfatter:  Slettet [ 25 jan 2006 19:21 ]
Titel: 

Chiller skrev:
Nogle mener der er en sammenhæng mellem soma (i den indiske tradition), ambrosia (i den græske/romerske tradition) og visse former for psykedelika. Det er jo kun en teori, men kunne nok være spændende at undersøge alligevel :wink:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soma :

"Hallucinogenic

There is no direct indication in the Rigveda [helligtekst i brahmanismen/hinduismen] that Soma is a mushroom. Nevertheless, the Vedas do not state that Soma was not a mushroom either, and several mushrooms have been suggested, most frequently (originally by R. Gordon Wasson in the 1960s) Amanita muscaria (Fly Agaric or Toadstool). The mushroom theory is supported by later Tibetan Buddhist legends connected with urine-drinking, and it is indeed possible that in Tibet, the shamanistic practice of eating psychedelic mushrooms, and subsequently drinking the urine of the one who has taken the mushroom, still containing much of the agent substance, has been connected with Vedic teminology surrounding Soma, but this would of course not imply that the plants used in Tibet were identical to the original Indo-Iranian Soma plant.

Terrence McKenna in his book "The Food Of Gods" debunks the Amarita Muscaria theory and suggests the psilocybin-containing Stropharia cubensis mushroom as a soma candidate. McKenna argues that effects of the Amarita Muscaria mushrooms contradict the description of Soma properties given in the Rigveda. Amarita Muscaria mushrooms hardly have any hallucinogenic properties, but rather produce inebriant effects. Psilocybin, the active psychoactive component in Stropharia Cubensis, on the other hand, has a strong hallucinogenic nature.

Cannabis was also suggested, also based on Tibetan evidence. The Tibetan word for Cannabis is So.Ma.Ra.Dza., apparently a borrowing from the Sanskrit soma-raja "king Soma" or possibly "soma rasa" / "soma juice" which could be the same as "bhang". The choice of Cannabis as a candidate is further supported by the traditional Zulu use of this drug for energizing warriors. Other candidates include Peganum harmala (Syrian Rue, suggested by David Flattery and Martin Schwartz in the 1980s), and species of Stropharia."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ambrosia :
"Many modern scholars, including Danny Staples, relate ambrosia to the hallucinogenic mushroom Amanita muscaria."


Den nuværende teori lader vist til at være, at Soma har været efedrin:

Citat:
Excavations of an early 2nd millennium BC BMAC site in the Kara Kum desert, Turkmenistan (Gonur South) revealed ceramic bowls in the context of a temple or shrine. The vessels were analysed by Professor Mayer-Melikyan and yielded traces of both Ephedra and Cannabis. In an adjacent room, ceramic pot-stands were found which appear to have been used in conjunction with strainers designed to separate the juices from the twigs, stems and leaves of the plants. A shrine at a later site (Togoluk 1, mid-second millennium) revealed a similar pottery strainer, but without traces of hallucinogenics. The late second millennium site Togoluk 21 yielded vessels containing traces of Ephedra again,in conjunction with pollen of poppies. These finds support the theory that the Indo-Iranian Sauma drink was a composite psychoactive substance comprising of Ephedra and variously Cannabis or Opium, and probably other ingredients, and that the Sauma plant was Ephedra. Other analyses of the residues from the Gonur and Togolok-21 vessels by Professor C.C. Bakels and other botanists, however, found traces only of broomcorn millet (Panicum miliaceum).


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soma#Ephedra

Forfatter:  Chiller [ 26 jan 2006 16:19 ]
Titel: 

Det skal sgu nok passe, veritas, jeg ved ikke så meget om det, lavede bare to minutters research for at hjælpe manden/kvinden :wink:

Forfatter:  kratoumet [ 26 jan 2006 16:52 ]
Titel: 

Jeg takker for jeres svar og hjælp, men tror desværre at jeg bliver nødt til at vælge et andet emne. Det lader ikke til det er til at finde helt nok materiale og kilder til at kunne fylde sådan en opgave ud, selvom det nu engang kunne være spændende...

Forfatter:  Rex Mundi [ 26 jan 2006 17:02 ]
Titel: 

Citat:
Jeg takker for jeres svar og hjælp, men tror desværre at jeg bliver nødt til at vælge et andet emne. Det lader ikke til det er til at finde helt nok materiale og kilder til at kunne fylde sådan en opgave ud,


bullshit :roll:

Forfatter:  kratoumet [ 26 jan 2006 20:08 ]
Titel: 

Rex Mundi skrev:
Citat:
Jeg takker for jeres svar og hjælp, men tror desværre at jeg bliver nødt til at vælge et andet emne. Det lader ikke til det er til at finde helt nok materiale og kilder til at kunne fylde sådan en opgave ud,


bullshit :roll:


præcis...

Forfatter:  Optimus Crime [ 26 jan 2006 21:28 ]
Titel: 

Hvorfor bullshit?

Narko i romerriget er sguda et random emne ikke til at finde ret meget om... og slet ikke nok til at fylde en hel 2g's opgave.

Må jeg se nogen af her hive bøger og tekster frem om netop det emne?

Forfatter:  Rex Mundi [ 26 jan 2006 21:31 ]
Titel: 

nej, naturligtvis ikke en HEL opgave om det, det tvivler jeg også på at det vil opfylde kriterierne til den opgave han har fået.

Men at skrive om romer riget, og også komme ind på deres brug af ethnogener, burde der ikke være nogen problemer i.

Forfatter:  Optimus Crime [ 26 jan 2006 21:52 ]
Titel: 

Hov ja ups... Jeg havde læst det somom han KUN ville skrive om entheogene planter i romerriget. Men efter en gennemlæsning af den originale post:

BULLSHIT

Forfatter:  Odden [ 26 jan 2006 22:06 ]
Titel: 

Random skrev:
Hov ja ups... Jeg havde læst det somom han KUN ville skrive om entheogene planter i romerriget. Men efter en gennemlæsning af den originale post:

BULLSHIT


kilder?




:P

Forfatter:  Optimus Crime [ 26 jan 2006 23:54 ]
Titel: 

Kilder på min fortolkning eller læsefejl af hans post? =)

Her er ihvertfald en kilde på at det er bullshit:

Billede

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